In a meeting with journalists from Central Asia, lead spokesperson for foreign affairs and security policy of the European Commission Peter Stano discussed the political significance of the upcoming EU-Central Asia summit, why the EU respects its partners' freedom of choice, and what role the countries of the region themselves play in preventing the sanctions circumvention. He also highlighted the benefits of cooperation with the EU and the benefits of integration for the countries of the region.
About EU-Central Asia summit
When asked by a Gazeta.uz correspondent about the upcoming EU-Central Asia summit, involving the region’s heads of state and the two presidents of the EU, the European Commission speaker said the summit is expected to occur this year, although the dates have not yet been set.
“Usually this is being settled closer to when it’s expected to happen. I have the strong feeling that a summit should happen in Uzbekistan,” he commented.
“This summit is very important politically. This summit is the expression of how much we value the partnership and that we are willing to confirm it at the highest political level,” Peter Stano highlighted. “So in the world of political messaging and diplomacy, this plays a huge role. We don’t have such summits with everyone. If you look at the partnerships the European Union has with countries around the world, you don’t have that many which have top level summits. [For instance,] Ukraine, of course, because for us it is like the top priority.”
“It's really reflecting [the partnership dynamics] and it’s more symbolic than practical. But the fact that it’s happening is just confirmation from both sides how important we find our partnership, and how determined we are to continue developing it,” he noted.
The agenda together with the date will be set in cooperation with partners, Peter Stano shared.
“The more actors, the more complicated it is. We have 27 countries and you have five countries. So to try to find the appropriate date, to secure the appropriate level of representation is sometimes a logistical challenge. We will have the European elections over very soon. We’ll have all the clarity about the names of the new leaders of the institutions with the mandate that the current council will finish at the end of October.”
“It won’t, not take much time on our side to be ready for the summit. And I think on the side of Central Asia, I don’t see any problems that should slow these preparations down. So there is commitment. There is willingness. I hope we will still see the summit happening this year.”
Peter Stano also responded to a list of questions from journalists. Gazeta.uz shares other important quotes of the European Commission’s spokesperson from this meeting.
On free choice of partners
Geography is very relentless when it comes to determining who your neighbors are. You cannot erase geographical and historical links your countries have. We are very much aware of this. We are not preventing countries from having their free choices, because this is what Ukraine is fighting for and why we are supporting Ukraine. Every country should be entitled to make free with whom they want to develop their partnerships.
This is about the right of countries to be independent and to make independent choices. It’s a very basic right of each country, because each nation has a right to exist and each country that is a normal, proper country, like Ukraine, like your country or my country, they have the right to exist without anyone from outside dictating them with whom they can work or with whom they cannot work.
When it comes to Russia, we are only saying we are not going to force you to do anything. We are just saying, right now, we are in such a situation that one of your neighbors or very important partners is violating international rules, and there cannot be business as usual with someone who is in such a blatant violation of these rules. Because today [due to these violations] it is Ukraine [that is suffering], but tomorrow it can be Uzbekistan or any other country.
It is not a condition in our partnership, like you have to ditch all your links with Russia, with China, with anyone else. We don’t want to change your ties with Russia. Our partnerships are not exclusive. We are not saying if you go with us, you cannot go with anyone else. We know that the world in the end is transactional. So everyone tries to go shopping around, to get most of the benefits. We are just saying, we believe in certain principles, which work for us. I think they can work for you as well.
Just look at our track record of how many dependencies you create by developing links with the EU, and how many dependencies which are not really beneficial for you, you are creating with some other partners that are really using coercive methods.
We respect the free choice of the countries. We have our red lines for ourselves, we have our expectations for the partners, but we are not going to take it against you if you decide to continue to work with Russia because it’s in your vital national interest.
We are not trying to impose anything. You are best placed to judge what works for your national interests. If you want to work with Turkey, Iran, China, Russia, with the EU, it’s your decision and no one else’s. The only thing we can say, based on our own experience, whatever you do, just think about two things.
Don’t create unnecessary dependencies because they can liquidate your independence, your sovereignty, or your territorial integrity. And try to diversify as much as you can so that you are not dependent only on one supply or only on one partner. Diversification and preventing creation of dependencies is the best way you can reduce the risks from any uneven relationship.
On sanctions
The one question where we are very strong is the circumvention of the sanctions. If anyone tries to help Russia in circumventing our sanctions, then, they expose themselves also to the possibility of being sanctioned by the European Union.
When it comes to sanctions, be very careful, because as long as we have the war, we have the sanctions, and as long as we have the sanctions, there will be attempts to circumvent. We can close one area of circumvention and then another will spring up. Because the private business is always one step ahead, because they are very smart, very flexible. The legislation comes only after.
So we need cooperation from the authorities, especially from the countries which are being used for export of especially sensitive goods, which are dual use goods and prohibited already by our sanctions, but find somehow their way to Russia through intermediaries.
This is something on our radar. And the trends depend on the country. When we see the initial spike in some countries and once the contacts are established, our engagement is going on and authorities take measures, you see that it’s a downward trend. Or it’s cyclical, you do something, they go down and then they find another possibility, they go up. It’s just natural. We are trying to tackle it both pragmatically, politically and then also through sanctions and our partners in all economies.
Right now we are working on the 14th package of sanctions (at the moment of publication, the package is already approved by the EU — ed. note). We already adopted 13 wide ranging packages of sanctions, basically sanctioning everything, what we could. We are working constantly because there are always some loopholes or the real life brings the loopholes or the flexibility and creativity of the economic operators brings to the light situations which we didn’t think through in the law making. So we are constantly reviewing it.
We are an organization which is based on the rule of law. That means we have a legislative framework. That means our actions are based on laws and legislation. We cannot just sanction someone or punish someone, or ban someone or fine someone because we don’t like what they are doing. We need to have a legal basis and evidence for it.
At the same time we engage with the authorities of the country where this [sanctions circumvention] is happening. Because those countries have better means to take steps to prevent, they have better means than us because we are someone from outside. But if the companies are just in your country and you have your laws, then you can use your laws to regulate the activities of the company. So that’s why whenever we see the spike, we go to the country, we discuss it with them. And we try to see if it’s possible to work together.
On cooperation with EU
What are the limitations and opportunities in our partnership? Basically, the sky’s the limit. In this case, the sky is defined by the desires of both sides. And we sense that with most of the countries in Central Asia we will go as far as our partners want to.
The EU is a transparent, predictable partner, with us you know what you are getting into, what you are buying. Rules, principles and laws. Respect for the laws. For everyone doing business, predictability and transparency is very important because it allows you to plan your investment, your benefits, your earnings, your proceedings.
So, the limitations are defined by our partners. On our side the basic limitations are, of course, our principles and values. But they are so general that I think every country, almost every country in the world, is subscribing at least formally. So that means human rights, a certain level of democracy and freedoms. Of course, we cannot expect everyone to be as free and democratic as ourselves. We don’t want to export and impose our model. We want to promote our principles. It’s part of our partnerships. it’s not a situation in a way that we would be forcing someone to something. You want to work with us? Fine. We go as far as possible, as far as you want.
For example with Armenia in the past we had very close agreements, called Association Agreements, like with a number of countries in the eastern neighborhood. Then at one point Armenia decided to backtrack. They stepped out and said, we are going to join the Eurasian Union. The European Union said, okay and scaled back. We developed a different type of agreement, which was not so close, not so enthusiastically, not all encompassing. We respond to the level of the ambition of our partners.
Nowadays, Armenia is coming back saying we want more cooperation with the European Union. So, we are discussing how we will enhance what we have, how we will upgrade the partnership we have. It depends on the wishes of the partners.
On regional benefits of integration
Look where regional integration brought us. We have Schengen, free movement of people within huge territory from basically from Estonia to Portugal, the whole European continent, without the need to show your ID, without the need to stop at the borders. We have a single currency. So you don’t need to change money. You don’t need to lose money on commissions, and change, and have five different wallets to keep different currencies. We have the same rights everywhere in the EU, we can work, we can study, we can leave, we can do whatever we want. We can get medical healthcare in any of the countries of the European Union.
So the integration has absolutely amazing benefits for everyone, for the populations. And integration is actually the answer to all the problems you are facing. Because another slogan of the EU is “together we are stronger”. You better face the challenges when you work together. And especially in Europe, we are very diverse in terms of languages, ethnicities, nations, historical context and experiences. Central Asia is relatively more compact compared to Europe. So you have all of the natural bases [for integration]. Of course, you have the historical issues, more bilaterally between the countries. But again, remember, Germany and France have been killing each other for centuries. Nowadays we are sharing laughter.
Integration is the way to go because it removes the artificial boundaries between the nations, between groups of people. And it allows you to grow together. Maybe retaining your identity but being enriched by all the others. It’s based on respect and this is something we are definitely encouraging in the case of Central Asia.
It’s really amazing what integration can bring in terms of benefits for ordinary people, overcoming all the centuries of conflicts and divisions and working togetherю
On EU’s future
When asked by a journalist whether he had any fears about the future of the EU if anti-European integration forces came to power, Peter Stano replied that any decision would be an expression of people’s will.
The EU is not a model imposed from above, from Brussels or from political actors. The EU was founded by member states to be there for the citizens. The original idea was to prevent wars through cooperation, to have a lot of economic cooperation, so that we have peace so that they cooperate together and don’t fight each other.
“The EU was always a project for the people, and the people are determining the design and the layout of the European Union. So if the far right or far left or whatever, anti-system or alternative parties form governments and gain a majority in the EU, maybe they will take the European Union in a different direction than it is going now, but it will be the reflection of the will of the people. We, in Brussels, the institutions are the servants of the member states, and the member states are represented by the governments who are elected by the citizens. So whatever the citizens want, they will get,” Peter Stano highlighted.
He added that he has no worries about the future of the EU, because in the end, the EU reflects the wishes of their populace. “That's the nature of democracy that needs to be respected,” the EU spokesperson stated.
